Hello lawyers :)

[lovingboth]

Is there a definition of "public place" as it relates to soliciting in England and Wales?

The exisiting offence is s1 Street Offences Act 1959: 'to loiter or solicit in a street or public place for the purpose of prostitution'. It then goes on to define 'street' as including bridges, subways and doorways onto the street etc etc etc... but I can't find a definition of 'public place'.

Until repealled, the Sexual Offences Act 1956 prohibited men to 'solicit or importune in a public place for immoral purposes' (no cruising, in other words) but again, I can't find a definition.

Another act, London Local Authorities Act 2004, says s22's '"public place" includes any highway and any other premises or place in the open to which at the material time the public have or are permitted to have access (whether on payment or otherwise).'

The problem with that definition is its scope. The public is admitted to a wide range of places... yet I can't find any instances where, for example, prostitutes working indoors have been charged with 'soliciting'.

Another law, the Charities and Trustee Investment (Scotland) Act 2005, snatched at random, says 'public place' means 'any road' and 'any other place .. to which members of the public have access .. is not within a building [except for] a public area within any station, airport or shopping precinct or is any other similar public area' - unless the public have to pay / have a ticket for admission. Phew.

So the definition is generally inconsistent, which doesn't help.

I'm asking partly because someone's asked me about soliciting in hotel bars and partly because Scotland is looking to change its soliciting laws to include an even wider definition of 'public place'.

(Don't get me started on the Scottish Police Federation who want to delete 'public place', making buying and selling of sex illegal...)

Comments

[vampwillow]

a hotel bar would be an interesting one. A "Public House" is, by definition, a public place and, I'm guessing, any licenced premises -such as a hotel bar - might also fall under that definition. I once heard of a definition that was something like "any place the Police may enter without requiring a search warrant and not in hot persuit" ...

[drdoug.livejournal.com]

The definitive answer would be if any of the relevant Acts define a public place ... but since they don't, I suspect it's not totally clear. My understanding is that 'public place' has mutually contradictory definitions in different areas of the law. I recall much amusement at the legal contortions required to support the conclusion that a locked public toilet cubicle is a public place if you're committing an act of gross indecency, but is not a public place if you're having a pee.

A private domestic dwelling is definitely not a public place, or the term has no meaning. Although you can let whomever you choose in to your house, casual passing visitors from the street are not generally admitted.

But a hotel bar is almost certainly on the borderline (it's indoors, the licensee explicitly has the power to stop people coming in, you are expected either be a resident or to buy a drink if you're hanging around there, but OTOH there's an implicit invitation to the general public to wander in off the street). I think you'll need not only a lawyer but one experienced in this area of the law!

[lovingboth]

But a pub isn't, at least in some regards.

You're only allowed in at certain times, you need to be a certain age, you can be 'barred' and, until the latest set of licencing laws, they weren't even supposed to let you in the door if you were a prostitute!

[lovingboth]

That gross indecency one was deciding it wasn't 'private' ('not private' doesn't mean 'public' - there was a similar set of arguments over prison cells). It's now specifically illegal in the Sexual Offences Act 2003... which also lists it as a place you can expect privacy!

My feeling is still that a hotel bar isn't, partly because of the various restrictions but mostly because no-one seems to have been 'done' for it. Unlike, for example, sitting completely stationary in a window.

[goodarcher.livejournal.com]

DPP v Bull (sorry don't recall year) is an interesting case re: male prostitution in a public place - it looks at the wording of the 1956 and 1959 Acts and comes to the conclusion that "prostitution" in the 10959 Act only applies to women!

[lovingboth]

Yep, that's right. The SOA 2003 made it gender neutral... and before then, men got done for 'importuning for an immoral purpose' instead.